Behind the Scenes of Your Golf Tour: Q&A with Wil from Rams Hill
Wil Mayo is the Senior Director of Sales and Marketing at Rams Hill Golf Club, where the second event of Your Golf Tour's inaugural season took place. Wil was generous enough to sit down and spill a bit of tea with us, letting us in on how YGT ended up at Rams Hill, prepping for the event, and which player liked slip and slide the most.
Take a look at our full conversation below, or follow us on Instagram for snippets of the best bits of our chat.
Getting YGT to Rams Hill
Let’s start at the beginning – obviously the event was meant to be at Teeth of the Dog in the Dominican Republic, but it became clear that wasn't feasible. So you contacted them, they contacted you? How did that all work?
Yeah, the YGT team contacted us. I had a bit of a relationship with Josh Morgan, who is part of the team now, which was called the Provisions Group, and he in part represents Grant and the Bryan Bros. So we had talked probably 3, 4 years ago, maybe 5, about seeing if Grant wanted to come out to Rams Hill, if we could set something up. And, at least in my gig, we have those type of conversations all the time and they don't always happen, and that's totally okay.
I think the key with that kind of stuff is just making relationships instead of making transactions. So I guess when the proverbial stuff hit the fan for them, they needed somebody to fill the void where they could come on short notice and make Event 2 happen. So Josh thought of me, which is great, and I got a text from him that just said, “Are you still at Rams Hill?” “Yeah.” “Can you jump on the phone like right now?” “Yeah.” And that's how it went down.
Is that something, do you think, that lots of golf courses are doing – developing relationships in the YouTube space?
That's a good question. I don't know. And I don't really know that we were that intentional about the YouTube space before the whole YGT thing went down. It certainly has my antennas up more now. I think we've always made an effort to be a place where creative people felt like they could accomplish their goals and we would support them in that.
I think, for us, at least where we're physically located in Southern California, we do have a bit of a competitive advantage, if you will, because there's so many creative people in our backyard, so many people who are trying to make it through their own platforms that it felt irresponsible to not lean into that kind of side of the business. And so I don't know, it's a really good question. I don't know how much others are putting into it. And I also know that it's one corner of my job and it probably could be a full-time job - to lean into the YouTube space. But we're certainly more interested now.
I guess once you do it once, it could open up all sorts of opportunities, couldn't it? Would you imagine that going forward they will want to come back to the same courses for YGT in the future?
You know, I don't know. I mean, we'd love it if they wanted to. I think that we made a lot of good friends out of it. I think that we were both able to support each other and really put together something that was successful for YGT, successful for the individual creators, and certainly successful for Rams Hill. If they wanted to come back, we'd obviously love to talk about it, but I'm of the belief that YGT and YouTube Golf is just kind of a rocketship, and they're going to have the opportunity to go just about anywhere they want, and I'm going to support them no matter where that is.
I do know that through the 6 weeks or so that we were kind of iteratively in discussions every day about pre-planning and operations and things like it, it was a way just to make natural connections with some of these guys. And I've stayed in touch with Ruffels and Roger and I text about some stuff that they might want to do. And again, the through line that we wanted to leave them with was whatever your next big idea is, if you need somewhere to do it, then we want you to think about us because we want to help you again, just support you in accomplishing your goals.
Friends in high places.
I guess. At least this direction going that way, for sure.
Prepping the Course
Photo courtesy of Troy Knight / Rams Hill
So once they agreed, or it was agreed upon that they were coming, what did you have to do for the course? Did they want it set up in a certain way? I'm guessing in the heat of the summer, there's only so much you can do to – it's always going to be rock hard and playing pretty fast.
Yeah, well, it gets a little bit inside baseball with some of the agronomy stuff, but for us with the type of turf that we have, it's called TifTuf Bermuda grass, which is what our fairways and surrounds are. That turf actually likes the heat. But in that, when you perform course maintenance, when folks see aerification or that kind of stuff, you actually want to perform that when the turf is thriving. For us, that actually takes place in the summer when we wanted to kind of rip up the golf course and do all the maintenance, which is good because we're not as busy in the summer as we are other times. We don't have to displace as much play. But that being said, we had our summer maintenance schedule, which is pretty thorough and had been planned for a year.
So the biggest thing on our end really was confirming that we could adjust our maintenance schedule to accommodate YGT, but that it also wouldn't have any negative effects on the upcoming season. So we took that to the USGA, we have an agronomist that we kind of have on a retainer, I guess, of sorts to just confer about with all of our maintenance practices. But that was the biggest question mark – can we move this maintenance and make this happen?
We wanted it obviously to be super tight, everything to be tournament conditions. We wanted it to show up well on the drones, which is probably me more worried about that than anybody else. But what we really wanted to do is make sure it was playable for the good players and that they really appreciated what we had. And I think they did. And then there was the ops of it all, which goes well beyond setup.
But as far as course setup, most of that was the YGT guys. The captains chose the tees where they wanted to play. Obviously they're interested in some fireworks, so we had a lot of short 4s and they set all the holes. There's a lot of chatter about pins and bowls online, but I just shove all that credit or blame to Wesley and George and Grant and Brad.
Opening Night at Borrego Springs Yacht Club
Photo courtesy of Troy Knight / Rams Hill
So when they all got there, what is the process? They arrived, and you had an opening party at the Borrego Springs Yacht Club. What's that all like? Is it quite a formal affair, do they have a couple of beers – what do they get up to the night before?
Yeah, so the yacht club is fun. For those that know Rams Hill, we're in the middle of the desert. If you look on Google Maps, you know, the concept of a yacht club being there would seem kind of counterintuitive. But what it is – there was an old 27-hole routing at Rams Hill, and one of the old par 3s subsequently over time was kind of converted into a hang spot with a tiki bar. And there's water where the water used to be on that golf hole. We don't really program that into the experience, but the problem is it's so cool on the internet and so fun and interesting that everybody wants to kind of touch this yacht club and see what that's all about. So what we do is one day a year, we open the yacht club to anybody who wants to check it out. That's the day before our annual tournament that we call the Clash.
But long story short, the guys were interested in that being part of the experience, and we knew the wildcard thing was going to happen on that first night. So the guys all got there kind of on their own time schedule. Some guys went out and hit it around a few holes, practice round, film a little content.
And then we had the wildcard reveal up at the clubhouse. And that was super fun. I was surprised at how good of a job they did. When I watched the first one, I was like, okay, so everybody knows who the wildcards are, right? But they didn't. We had a separate house for them to hang out in until we were ready – it was real lock and key.
So we had the reveal, we had a pizza truck show up, which I don't think made the edit, but that was cool. Guys were hammering pizzas and then we went down to the yacht club and hung out. No beers. I didn't see many beers go down.
It’s serious business.
So that was the lead-up. And then the next day was designated a practice round day and then subsequent competition the next 2 days.
Photo courtesy of Troy Knight / Rams Hill
Playing Rams Hill
How did they play the course compared to your run-of-the-mill golfer who plays there? Did you watch them play the whole round, and did they play it very differently to how most people would play it?
I mean, they're stupid long. It was insane to see some of the angles that they take, or what would feel like a risky play to me standing on the tee. It's crazy how long these guys are.
They were carrying a lot of doglegs, weren't they?
Oh, it was insane. And I mean, their skill level obviously just leads them to play it a little differently than Joe Golfer. But I do think, I don't know about from the viewer perspective, but I know from the player perspective, there's nothing more fun in golf than watching your ball roll slowly towards the hole. I think some of those surrounds and bowls allow for that. So definitely, yeah, they got to experience that same joy that Joe Golfer gets to which is what made me fall in love with Rams Hill.
And they were doing that from all over the place. Their short game as well, even relatively basic chips – [they were] playing shots that were obviously easier, but that almost made it look more complicated, hitting it 30 feet away from the pin and letting it roll back.
Well, and the difference probably between them and me is, my favourite thing about Rams Hill is I can kind of mishit it and sometimes, and if it catches the right slope it’ll roll down, and I’m like “That's exactly how I drew it up”. But for them, it was usually what they want to do.
Photo courtesy of Troy Knight / Rams Hill
Life on Tour
And so they all stay on course. I'm assuming you've got a bit of accommodation there?
Yep. So we have houses that we have basically built like a rental program out of, and those are right near the golf course. We also have some resorts in town, but it was important to the YGT folks that everybody stayed as close as possible to the golf course because – I mean, these guys put in so many hours, it was impressive. So it was important that they were close, just given the proximity of all the stuff they had to do in the relatively short amount of time.
But it was also important that each team stayed together in a house. So like Brad's team was in a house and Grant's team was in a house and that didn't really make the cut, but I know that that was important from like a camaraderie and team building.
I wondered about that - whether it was very separated during the tournament or whether they all hang out together.
Yeah, I mean, clearly everybody on property is all friendly with each other. I mean, these guys are building something together that's really special, so I think that lends them to all be kind of communal, but they were really intentional about teams being able to have that time to be a team and strategize. And like you said, it was serious business.
What do they get up to in the evening? Do they all go back to their team houses, or do they all hang out together?
I'm trying to think of the actual run of show for each day. I mean, it was jam-packed with golf. Also, on the competition days, just given the temperature – we tried to hug the dusk and the dawn so that it was a little cooler. So on the competition days, I mean, it was golf and a little bit of downtime in between.
We had slip and slide out there that we set up for the guys, kind of a fun surprise. We set this slip and slide up and we're like, I don't know if anybody's going to use this, like adult men. And it was – everybody was on the slip and slide.
Who enjoyed the slip and slide the most, do you think?
Probably Josh Kelley. I mean, at one point in time, he was incorporating golf trick shots into the slip and slide. Which was insane. So that was cool. I mean, it was just, to be honest, it was—it wasn't too different from what I'd expect a bunch of 60 dudes to come do when they're playing golf. Fun. And a lot of communal meals they had some time for like meetings and stuff where they were able to go over the week's events, but also just spend time together and break bread and stuff.
I'm interested to hear what the Kiwi boys are like because they're the ones who are just banter, banter, banter on camera, aren't they? And so you wonder if they're just exactly like that in real life or whether they tone it down a bit.
It's funny, man. I think there was always like a little bit of natural trepidation on both sides. They're probably wondering, is this gonna work? Is this gonna be a good site? They're not familiar with our operation. And then our team's wondering, are these guys gonna be cool? Is this gonna be a cluster? Are we gonna be able to perform to the level that they need?
And everybody told me leading up to it, oh, you're gonna love these guys. They're great. You're gonna love them. And I'm thinking, I mean, everybody says that. We'll see. And they were like the nicest group of people. And it was so easy to work with literally every single person. The Kiwi guys were – I mean, everybody was cool. Tooms was awesome. Just a nice guy to be around. I don't have one bad thing to say about anybody. But yeah, what you saw is what you get when the camera's on, was my experience.
Peter Finch is another who just is who he is on camera. He was just a guy, I always found myself wanting to be around him because I wanted to hear him say something funny. And Roger, all of his energy is exactly who he is. And at the end, when Roger's on that e-bike - that joy was real, and I think all that translates, and it's fun for people to feel like they could play golf with these dudes. And banter back with them and just have an awesome 4 hours out there together.
Photo courtesy of Troy Knight / Rams Hill
The Competitive Side
Were they very competitive when they were playing – who seemed to take it particularly seriously?
Yeah, it's for real. I wondered about that too, right? I was just a viewer before. I mean, I still am, but obviously I had a different lens for this one. But I wondered about that too, right? Do these guys really care? Are they grinding? Yeah. I mean, I'm pretty sure Ruffels had a club toss in there at one point in time, and that was real.
That might not have made the cut.
Might not have made the cut. I don't remember. But you know, Micah took it very seriously. It was cool to watch how much he wanted to win.
Yeah, he's got a lot better.
Yeah, and I think that as golfers we all understand that. When I'm playing my buddies for $5, you know, it's the worst feeling in the world to blow that. But I can't imagine for those stakes. It was very competitive, but clearly these guys like respect each other and also they want to put on a good product, right? So I think they want it to be competitive in that regard too.
Yeah, it's a good balance, isn't it? You get that sort of balance where there is the competitiveness but also the friendlier aspect. And they almost seem like they're sort of stuck in the middle sometimes – like when Finch and Roger Steele played together, they obviously get on very well and bounce off each other, but they were competing for the $300,000.
Yeah, for sure. And I think probably just like the human element, it's got to be interesting for those guys just knowing that they're in the midst of putting on something that is so special and going to be seen by so many people that I gotta imagine that's difficult for them to feel like they have to entertain and compete at the same time. But yeah, from what I saw, like you said, it is a good mix. That's why we watch pro golf, right? We like watching people perform at a high level. And you mix in that they're also interesting and you find yourself naturally rooting for people because of their personalities, then that’s a good combination.
Yeah, best of both worlds. And when they were eliminated, were they upset? A few of them were around in Round 3 who we saw on camera, but did anyone leave or did they all hang around?
Yeah, everybody hung around. I'm guessing that's, well, travel too. I mean, they probably all got it booked already, but yeah, everybody hung around, which was cool to see. Even in the heat, you could tell that the guys were invested in the competition because I think almost everybody who was eliminated came in and watched for good parts of the last round. But yeah, the guys didn't want to lose. You can tell they didn't want to lose. And even the wildcards, they come out there and we got 9 holes out of John Daly II. I'm sure he wanted to play a little more golf. But yeah, I gotta imagine missing a cut on tour probably stings a little more, but maybe not.
Yeah, it's almost even more so for the wildcards, isn't it? Because they only get one chance. These other guys, they could win $300,000 the next, or $60,000, whatever, the next time out. Not that they don't want to win each one, but the wildcards get one opportunity.
Yeah, it was definitely interesting to watch. And I don't know internally, who was feeling the most pressure or whatever about the money or just about wanting to perform at their highest level possible. But on the surface, it looked like everybody was taking it really seriously.
Photo courtesy of Troy Knight / Rams Hill
The YGT Effect
I want to ask you about YouTube golf sort of more generally and Rams Hill in particular, how it relates to that. You guys have been rated quite highly, top 100 courses by Golf Digest, I think, at various points, which obviously gets you a lot of exposure. And now you've been on Your Golf Tour, which gets you a lot of exposure. How do those two things compare? What do you think gets you more attention? Is it different people that it appeals to?
Yeah, that's a really good question. I've been here about 7 years now so it's been really interesting to watch our evolution over that time, at least on the internet. With our seasonality, our price point varies in the summer versus the peak season. So I was always kind of worried that as – and maybe worried's not the right term – but as we continue to climb in notoriety and supply and demand and just the cost of things, as our price goes up, would we [inadvertently] weed out all the people who think we're really cool on the internet? Who is our customer going to be? But I think that YGT specifically has shown us that we can be an aspirational golf destination for everybody.
And I think that there is a difference [in audience], right? Like my boss, Harry Turner, he's been in the golf game longer than I've been alive. And he goes on an 8-guy golf trip every year. I go on an 8-guy golf trip every year. So we want maybe different things out of that experience. But the real challenge for us is, okay, how do we position ourselves to be a place where we can please both sides of that spectrum?
When I think about my job and I've got an allocation of marketing dollars to spend, where's the most efficient and effective place to spend those dollars and who are you trying to target with it? We had a QR code in the 3rd video. We didn't know how many people would scan it. We had a good idea of roughly how many people we thought would watch the video, but we had over 10,000 people scan that QR code.
And for me, what I'm interested in is – I have no doubt that this is a good thing for Rams Hill. The question is how long will it take to really feel that on the ground? I always use the example of the guy in Iowa, that's middle America, who's never heard of Rams Hill before. Now he has to have. And does that mean he's coming next week? Well, no, but eventually - I hope that we're now on his mental bucket list. So one day he'll show up and we'll be able to trace that back to YGT. And maybe that extends as far as Australia.
Well, yeah, you've got the guy in Melbourne now. So if I'm ever in the US, I'll, I'll pop down.
Visiting Rams Hill
And what do you guys offer? As you’ve told me, you're very far away from everything, in the middle of the desert. So you've obviously got accommodation on property. So what is your sort of call to action for people when they're looking to come to Rams Hill? They stay and play and they play 2 rounds over the course of the weekend and stay on-site, or how does that all work?
Yeah, so we are about 2 hours from San Diego. We're actually in San Diego County, which kind of blows people's mind because I think when you think San Diego, you think right on the water, which we are definitely not. We're about 3 hours from LA and we're about an hour and a half from kind of Palm Springs to Coachella Valley, which is a golf hotbed. And then going the other directions, we're about 4 hours from Phoenix and about 5 hours from Vegas. So it's actually really drivable from a lot of people.
Today, if you look at our tee sheet on any given day, roughly 40% are people that are spending the night and wanting to play multiple days, which is huge for us. The longer we can extend people's stay, I think, a) the more enjoyable the experience we can provide, and b) it's obviously just better for business, right? So with that being said, I think that – you know, I'm a golfer, you're a golfer – [we want to be] a true destination golf resort. Guys like us want to play a lot of golf. So I think at least in the very short-term, we need to be able to serve both markets, we need to be able to serve folks who want to drive in for the day. But we also need to be a place where folks can come in and spend a couple nights and play a lot of golf.
So we do have houses that we rent on property, again, where the YGT guys stayed. And then we have some resorts in town, but we're actually in the process of building our own lodging, which is super exciting for us. We should have some cool announcements about that soon with some renderings and livestream of the construction. But I think it's all just part of kind of growing up into a true golf destination. And the first step is getting people's attention, which I think this helped us do.
